TheLegend-JAX

try and take a look at damage and armor types maybe?

rock paper scissors ftw

ecco

on a side note, iam a long time random player and orc mirror is like the only matchup i realy dont like to play. its so mind numbling boring to micro grunt vs grunt early game, they cant die anyway.

later it gets even more absurd with mass chainheal / scrolls and perma ensnaring each other :/

kristaps1991

If bm starts focusing grunt, it wont escape. Try to outmicro enemy. Standart unit build is best, just try to make something better for your army, like upgrade armor/attack , buy healscrools, sh3lvl + mana pot, this all helps and dont need to outmicro.

hostilepulse

first try to kill raiders , keep your sh alive , beware not to lose ur bm and the other is pretty much a matter of luck and items

hostilepulse

@hostilepulse
dude are u stupid ? We are talking about mirror

kimkenny

5 peons for gold mine
7 peons for gathering lumber
4 grunts, 2 raiders, 2 walkers, and one kodo
blade master and shadow hunter
charge popualtion of 50 for orc mirror match

in the battle
you must not try to kill enemie's BM.
ensnare or hex kodo at first and
order BM to kill enemie's walkers, since link is a quite great skill.
walkers to attack grunts.
healing scroll and level 3 of SH is essential.

i think the most important thing in orc vr orc match is the number of healing scrolls.

you can bring peons to maximize spirit link.

level difference quite affects a lot (critical strike and healing wave are very significant skill in mirror match.)

Nait18

@kimkenny
yeah its like that, n kill sh ofc with bm

Angina

@hostilepulse
lmao.

BelarusPower

@hostilepulse
he means orc is a freewin vs orc

SwordSaint

I play orc sometimes and here is something you might want to try if orc v orc really bores.
It's not the most strategically sound plan but it makes the game really fun and tense and i do it almost every time i get a orc v orc game:

Basically you go FS first and harass a little bit, and use the predictability of orc players against them. Most orcs will go BM + 1-3 grunts during their tech to t2. You go FS fast mill 1 tower in base dual rax and mass head hunters. You have to time it properly so you arrive right when the opponent is about to hit tier2 and head there with everything you've got + 3-4 peons and tower rush him.

Usually the other player is fucked since they have 3, maybe four grunts maximum vs 10-12 HH + 3 - 4 towers going up. I can easily say that vs mediocre players this works excellent, as it catches them offguard EVERY time.

Just remember there are a half dozen counters to this strat but it does make orc v orc a lot more fun :)

kume_V

@SwordSaint
i actualy encountered this
problem isat t2 orc can easily tower himself inside base for defense+do catas
2nd problem is if u arrive 1 second 2 late u r fs will never survive bm+sh focus
once u r hero is dead hea can slowly pick of u r hhs or even better if he built a good number of towers in his base already he can simply windwalk past u r towers/army to u base and kill u r economy
if u have all peons in burrows u don t get cash
if u don t have them in burrows u got like 8 peons total in base and he will kill them very fast
and meanwhile u try to do some dmg on him with burrows he just windwalks and waits for peons to come out
if u tp back u r towers are dead
if u don t u r economy is fucked so basicly u r stuck at his base and can advance cause of towers/cata and u r base is dead..
like u said this tactic is pretty easily countered so the only way u are going to win is against players without the mids of their own who only know what to do if they don t see it in replay

i d probably head (when i figured out what s going on) directly to u r base with those 3 grunts and bm + start amss tower defense i base and kill those 3 burrows and peons
without gold+ lumber u can t do towers
if u tp back to defend i tp to my base kill towers
seems pretty easy to me

SwordSaint

@SwordSaint
Your timing is wrong. Every time I do this, it's actually BEFORE they hit tier2.
NO 2nd hero.
_NO_ catapults.
1 BM + 30 food army max is what I'm against.

BM can walk past my entire army if he so wishes, but UNLESS he has mill and towers already BUILT he's fucked. You can use wolves and HH's to destroy any tower/mill in construction. Even if BM rapes your economy, 1 BM alone can never win base-race.

Your counter with BM and grunts going directly to my base is pretty sound, and yep it's one way to beat this strat. The problem is that the knee-jerk reaction of most players is to portal back as soon as they see towers :) and after they they turtle and fuck themselves over. Your going to have a hard time winning the base race though, as by the time you're getting tower rushed, I guarantee no peon of yours will leave your base alive to do a counter-TR.

Again, not the most perfect strat but it's hella fun :]

hypnosed

@hostilepulse
grunts raiders walkers --> 3 units mix
bears dryads --> 2 units mix

elf players are just more creative.

Dostertags

@kimkenny
yeah i usually tech at my second grunt if ime not wrong and by time the Sh is popping out i probly have my Bm lvl 3? but.... by the time i get 50 pop u sure i should go raid his base? like.. he is going to get reinforcements faster than me... so should i just bring a whole lot of scrolls and stuff? and what if the guy just decides to back in his base?

general plan... in battle, wind walk my bm to his walkers and rape em
2nd focus fire all my melee on 1 raider and kill it and then move to the next.. third.. all walkers on grutns. and keep alive teh gay SH....

oh a question: is dispell a good stuff to get? is it good to dispel his spirit link? or just a waste of time cuz he can re-spirit link? just askin :P

Wolvi-

you could also play fs fl and trush your opponent, works fine on some maps

ekknite

@kimkenny
Dispell is a must for spirit walkers -.- especially in mirror so you can dispell the oponent's buffs while you have spirit link and other buffs. If he re-spirit links, don't use dispell then since dispell = 100 mana and spirit link = 75. This option is something you decide. Some orc players just dispell oponent's spirit link which I think isn't smart since you're spirit walkers will lose more mana then them.
You need to dispell when he just used his scroll of protection(which normal orc players in mirror does buy and use) and other scrolls/buffs.
No mana for spirit walkers = useless spirit walkers (in my opinion).

Lvl 3 SH is essential, so when 2nd hero pops out creep with him and harass with your BM. Make sure that he can't creep too much (preferably make so that he's not able to creep at all).

I usually don't go raid his base but if I do, then you have to upgrade pillage.
Pillage is a great way for extra gold income while raiding your opponen'ts base.
If he teleports, then just use scroll of speed. If he ensnares some of your units, then TP out.

Xythical

@Wolvi-
y dont know how to realy counter that tactic with a blade master....

Wolvi-

@Wolvi-
getting the blade lvl 2 with pimp items, getting boots and harrassing the farseer mostly works pretty good. u can snipe out grunts easily too, its all about the timing

Xythical

@Wolvi-
Thx very much ;)

Wolvi-

@srsBro88
angel ur comment is so helpful ;o! tell us something king of orcmirrors

SK|Zechs

ensnare enemy kodo
grunts attack enemy raiders
raiders on enemy kodo or walkers
BM chopping enemy SH (or walkers, whichever works better for you)
Bring peons whenver possible to abuse spirit link