Forum > Warcraft III
Grubby -'pure fair player'
As a end of the Wc3l final, MYM got the first place and Mouz losed .
But there is something happened in the match that I think most of you don't know
So, here is some words from Fly100%
The whole stroy is too long ,so , I just get to the point
If you want to see the whole one ,please check
http://bbs.replays.net/message/130087/130087874.html
(make sure your chinese is good enough >< )
"The first 22 match is on Avalanche, and as you know, I lose connection in the match .
The lucky thing is the match have been already saved before I dropped.
Then , our manager Lie found Grubby is watching the replay of the SAVE GAME
and it happened BEFORE we load the save game .
( you can find many evidences in other player and reporter ）
Lie found the admin of WC3L , and Grubby's answer is ' I just watch only 2~3 mintues'.
And the admin told Lie he can not get any publishment on Gb...
I have been told this after the 22 game of LT, because Lie don't want to influence us.
I was shocked and I never thought Gb will do things like this .
They play really well on LT, and we have tried our best to fight .
Yes , we losed ，but I can not be reconciled.
Maybe next time , Grubby can win the match with a way more ' man '
When I started to play WC3,I often watch GB & Xiaot's replays ,and I got lots of help.
Even now ,Gb is still one the most great players in my heart.
But , I am sad.
( there is another suck things about Gb which happened in ROTK in Fly's stroy ,but I am tried to translate it ,and I am sure it will make some one unhappy.)
I am hurried to give this thread , so if there is some words or spell problems , forgave me T T
Posted: 2008-06-17 00:10:13
Comments
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Grubby is a great player because he learns very fast. And he learnt and used the chinese rules. OK it's not very fair play. But anyway, it did not influence the result at all.
The only interesting result in a big Grubby flaming thread like there has not been for a while ^^
The only interesting result in a big Grubby flaming thread like there has not been for a while ^^
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come on guys, no one dont really know how exactly it was, maybe after fly disced, grubby and mb others just thought about regame, so he just watched the replay (yes, as you can see, it is comon thing,i saw it numerous times that after game players just watch the game), then comes miss Lie and it ended like this, but i can understand fly and others, for me it is just one big missunderstanding, someone can be dissapointed and sad, but you never heard the other side (grubbys explanation)
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Since I'm the admin they are referring to I'd like to share the whole story from my point of view...
We were pretty much understaffed during the whole event (compared to other WC3L-finals in the past) and that's why we only had one admin taking care of the stage, observing the players and helping in case something goes wrong.
There were problems with Fly's PC before the match but in the end we decided to start the 2on2 since we couldn't reproduce the lag that he was talking about. Eventually Fly's PC begins to lag again in the middle of the first map (Avalanche), he pauses and saves the game. Our stage admin runs to their gaming-box and the decision is made to restart Fly's PC and the savegame needs to be played.
I was sitting in the back of the event, streaming Waaagh! TV, updating match details and news on the WC3L-website at this moment. I then decided to go up to the stage to make sure that none of the players watches the replay and when I arrived at the box of Mousesports, Lie (Fly's girlfriend and the mouz-manager during this event) came running to me, complaining about Grubby watching the replay and how that is completely unfair. I hurried to MYM's box but only found Moon and Grubby discussing. Their screens didn't show the replay, they were showing the LAN-tab of Warcraft 3 (as in: they were waiting for the savegame to be hosted).
After asking Grubby if he watched the replay he admitted it. Though Cassandra and him both added that they only watched the very first two minutes. Without going into more details about his excuse for doing this I went back to Lie to discuss things. She was now accompanied by mouz.HasuObs, mouz.ToD and SK.reis and they all started arguing how unfair this was. ToD explained how the strategy from Fly and Yumiko was a one-time-opportunity and how watching the replay would spoil it completely.
Now what were my options at this point?
a) Let the teams continue with the saved game and think about a possible punishment for MYM's behaviour later.
b) Forcing a regame on the same map.
c) Giving a default-win to Mousesports.
My very first intention was to chose b) but having ToD's words in mind, this would rather have been a punishment for mouz. Usually the easiest and most fair thing is to force a regame (just remember the fifth map between Moon and TH000 a couple of days before...) but in this case I didn't feel that it would have been the right thing to do.
Giving a default-win after a map is played for more than ten minutes and without evidence that one team had an advantage over the other due to their actions is a really tough decision to make and is absolutely not covered by our rules. I explained this to Lie and the other bystanders and decided in the end to go with option a).
Mousesports was of course disappointed with this decision but I'm sure a default-win for them would have been the wrong decision as well. I am sorry for mouz though I believe that the match was not won by MYM just because of their brief knowledge of the replay.
After the whole tournament was over, Grubby explained the whole situation to me and apologized for what he had done. It's none of my business to explain his behaviour or excuse it in any way - that's his job. I just wanted to explain how the whole incident looked from my point of view.
We were pretty much understaffed during the whole event (compared to other WC3L-finals in the past) and that's why we only had one admin taking care of the stage, observing the players and helping in case something goes wrong.
There were problems with Fly's PC before the match but in the end we decided to start the 2on2 since we couldn't reproduce the lag that he was talking about. Eventually Fly's PC begins to lag again in the middle of the first map (Avalanche), he pauses and saves the game. Our stage admin runs to their gaming-box and the decision is made to restart Fly's PC and the savegame needs to be played.
I was sitting in the back of the event, streaming Waaagh! TV, updating match details and news on the WC3L-website at this moment. I then decided to go up to the stage to make sure that none of the players watches the replay and when I arrived at the box of Mousesports, Lie (Fly's girlfriend and the mouz-manager during this event) came running to me, complaining about Grubby watching the replay and how that is completely unfair. I hurried to MYM's box but only found Moon and Grubby discussing. Their screens didn't show the replay, they were showing the LAN-tab of Warcraft 3 (as in: they were waiting for the savegame to be hosted).
After asking Grubby if he watched the replay he admitted it. Though Cassandra and him both added that they only watched the very first two minutes. Without going into more details about his excuse for doing this I went back to Lie to discuss things. She was now accompanied by mouz.HasuObs, mouz.ToD and SK.reis and they all started arguing how unfair this was. ToD explained how the strategy from Fly and Yumiko was a one-time-opportunity and how watching the replay would spoil it completely.
Now what were my options at this point?
a) Let the teams continue with the saved game and think about a possible punishment for MYM's behaviour later.
b) Forcing a regame on the same map.
c) Giving a default-win to Mousesports.
My very first intention was to chose b) but having ToD's words in mind, this would rather have been a punishment for mouz. Usually the easiest and most fair thing is to force a regame (just remember the fifth map between Moon and TH000 a couple of days before...) but in this case I didn't feel that it would have been the right thing to do.
Giving a default-win after a map is played for more than ten minutes and without evidence that one team had an advantage over the other due to their actions is a really tough decision to make and is absolutely not covered by our rules. I explained this to Lie and the other bystanders and decided in the end to go with option a).
Mousesports was of course disappointed with this decision but I'm sure a default-win for them would have been the wrong decision as well. I am sorry for mouz though I believe that the match was not won by MYM just because of their brief knowledge of the replay.
After the whole tournament was over, Grubby explained the whole situation to me and apologized for what he had done. It's none of my business to explain his behaviour or excuse it in any way - that's his job. I just wanted to explain how the whole incident looked from my point of view.
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@Shawn
Thank you for the information shared. However, as you said you picked option a). So ok, you have executed the first part of the option so far, but how about the part where you have to punish MyM for watching the replay? I haven't heard anything about this yet. Furthermore, I don't believe that one "sorry" from Grubby (which by the way he uses really often when he screws up, and probably already lost its meaning) is enough to avoid their punishment. So I want to ask you, is MyM going to face the consequences of the what Grubby did, or are they going to be left unpunished?
Thank you for the information shared. However, as you said you picked option a). So ok, you have executed the first part of the option so far, but how about the part where you have to punish MyM for watching the replay? I haven't heard anything about this yet. Furthermore, I don't believe that one "sorry" from Grubby (which by the way he uses really often when he screws up, and probably already lost its meaning) is enough to avoid their punishment. So I want to ask you, is MyM going to face the consequences of the what Grubby did, or are they going to be left unpunished?
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@RotterdaM
this is not a China VS rest of the WORLD case````it is MYM VS MOUZ
also I have been Grubby's fans for years but Grubby is pretty unpolite sometimes
this is not a China VS rest of the WORLD case````it is MYM VS MOUZ
also I have been Grubby's fans for years but Grubby is pretty unpolite sometimes
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@AuroraFairY
You are the one who do not get it~ do you really now what was happening in that game? THOOO had 1 expention and GRUBBY did not have```` THOOO had a pop up to 50 Grubby was less than 30 and plus GRUBBY's BM was going to die in 5 secends````and the only fault THOOO had is he did not inform the judge before he paused the game``` every body knows GRUBBY was lossing the game and the "ORC KING" want a convinent win```` balless GRUBBY where is the spirit of orc king has gone????
You are the one who do not get it~ do you really now what was happening in that game? THOOO had 1 expention and GRUBBY did not have```` THOOO had a pop up to 50 Grubby was less than 30 and plus GRUBBY's BM was going to die in 5 secends````and the only fault THOOO had is he did not inform the judge before he paused the game``` every body knows GRUBBY was lossing the game and the "ORC KING" want a convinent win```` balless GRUBBY where is the spirit of orc king has gone????
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@Shawn
thank your explaination but would you give a little bit more on should the GRUBBY'S action be considered as cheat? or a serous rule break? If it does don't you think your decision was made without taking the most important fact into account??
thank your explaination but would you give a little bit more on should the GRUBBY'S action be considered as cheat? or a serous rule break? If it does don't you think your decision was made without taking the most important fact into account??
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@AuroraFairY
Grubby was owning that game. Should have been def win
Grubby was owning that game. Should have been def win
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@AuroraFairY
IF YOU DONT KNOW ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED, THEN SHUT THE FUCK UP!
At ROTK, Grubby was getting RAPED by TH000 all game...
see the fucking replay for urself: http://w3g.replays.net/doc/cn/2008-5-2/12097198652343855144.html
Then TH paused cuz of computer problem, and resume by accident (he was trying to save game instead) without telling grubby. Even though TH paused 1 sec after, grubby now demands a fucking REMATCH, using some tournament rule as an excuse. Of course TH wont take this shit and both sides argued for a while. grubby eventually "DOESNT FEEL LIKE PLAYING" and refs decided to give him loss.
Also check chatlog for grubby's excellent manners.
If anything, TH000 was the VICTIM at ROTK. Full report on this: http://news.replays.net/page/20080502/1377788.html
IF YOU DONT KNOW ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED, THEN SHUT THE FUCK UP!
At ROTK, Grubby was getting RAPED by TH000 all game...
see the fucking replay for urself: http://w3g.replays.net/doc/cn/2008-5-2/12097198652343855144.html
Then TH paused cuz of computer problem, and resume by accident (he was trying to save game instead) without telling grubby. Even though TH paused 1 sec after, grubby now demands a fucking REMATCH, using some tournament rule as an excuse. Of course TH wont take this shit and both sides argued for a while. grubby eventually "DOESNT FEEL LIKE PLAYING" and refs decided to give him loss.
Also check chatlog for grubby's excellent manners.
If anything, TH000 was the VICTIM at ROTK. Full report on this: http://news.replays.net/page/20080502/1377788.html
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@pan7heR
the one losing was grubby, you shitfag
the one losing was grubby, you shitfag
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@AuroraFairY
yea being racist is also very common for ignorant idiots like urself
yea being racist is also very common for ignorant idiots like urself
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@Shawn
fair enough.
but what happened to the possible punishment later?
fair enough.
but what happened to the possible punishment later?
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@pan7heR
wtf is with this "COMMON TO WATCH SAVE GAME REPLAY IN CHINA" bullshit?
wtf is with this "COMMON TO WATCH SAVE GAME REPLAY IN CHINA" bullshit?
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@AuroraFairY
pretty hard to explain this kind of thing.. I mean, he cheated, and that's it. We can probably expect some public apology though
pretty hard to explain this kind of thing.. I mean, he cheated, and that's it. We can probably expect some public apology though
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Shawn, we are waiting for the official statement about the punishment!
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@Romantony
are u kidding me
are u kidding me
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@AuroraFairY
So that gives Th000 the right to watch the saved game replay?
MYM gets a defloss for not wanting to continue the game against TH000 because Th000 watched the replay. Where is fairness? The chinese admins are unfair and biased. And they are the ones who said it is ok to watch saved game replays! No punishment.
It's not a wonder why Grubby did the same thing back. I would have done it too since the chinese insist it is ok.
So that gives Th000 the right to watch the saved game replay?
MYM gets a defloss for not wanting to continue the game against TH000 because Th000 watched the replay. Where is fairness? The chinese admins are unfair and biased. And they are the ones who said it is ok to watch saved game replays! No punishment.
It's not a wonder why Grubby did the same thing back. I would have done it too since the chinese insist it is ok.
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@AuroraFairY
There would be no replay watching If Grub decides to play on instead of requesting a rematch knowing hes getting raped all over. Way to go grub, requesting regame because TH didn't ask you for resuming game(plus he did it accidently and pause again after 1 fucking second).
seeing many chinese audience PAID to see the games, the best thing for grub to do would be to play on (like right after) instead of having the audience to wait for 2+hrs just cuz he can't take the loss like a man. Watch the replay and tell me if grub has any chance..
wnv and TH only watched replay because they think grub is getting rematch after some heavy arguement.
There would be no replay watching If Grub decides to play on instead of requesting a rematch knowing hes getting raped all over. Way to go grub, requesting regame because TH didn't ask you for resuming game(plus he did it accidently and pause again after 1 fucking second).
seeing many chinese audience PAID to see the games, the best thing for grub to do would be to play on (like right after) instead of having the audience to wait for 2+hrs just cuz he can't take the loss like a man. Watch the replay and tell me if grub has any chance..
wnv and TH only watched replay because they think grub is getting rematch after some heavy arguement.
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@AuroraFairY
aurora, did you even read what he wrote? Now that Robmeister wrote about it I remember the incident. th000 had Grubby's base towered and had a level 3 Mk with 100 mana vs a 50 hp Blademaster with 0 mana nearby or something.
There was no need to even argue about giving rematch or something. And if th000 watches the rep just to decide if Grubby deserves a rematch is something totally different from what Grubby did at the wc3l finals.
aurora, did you even read what he wrote? Now that Robmeister wrote about it I remember the incident. th000 had Grubby's base towered and had a level 3 Mk with 100 mana vs a 50 hp Blademaster with 0 mana nearby or something.
There was no need to even argue about giving rematch or something. And if th000 watches the rep just to decide if Grubby deserves a rematch is something totally different from what Grubby did at the wc3l finals.
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@AuroraFairY
you totally got it wrong with th000 vs grub, grub didnt want to play because th000 unpaused the game for some seconds without asking and not cuz th00 watched the savegame, with this fact your argument is useless, besides your second thing with chinese organisations always manipulate their tournaments is bullshit too, in the last game @pgl finals th000 was winning as he had a lvl5mk and a lvl3 pala with an eco advantage (he had a mine while moon had none) so what reason would there be that the chinese admins think th000 is losing and they need to restart the game somehow
you totally got it wrong with th000 vs grub, grub didnt want to play because th000 unpaused the game for some seconds without asking and not cuz th00 watched the savegame, with this fact your argument is useless, besides your second thing with chinese organisations always manipulate their tournaments is bullshit too, in the last game @pgl finals th000 was winning as he had a lvl5mk and a lvl3 pala with an eco advantage (he had a mine while moon had none) so what reason would there be that the chinese admins think th000 is losing and they need to restart the game somehow
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@dash
"breast knuckles"? wow.. what are those? like a fist with some boobs around it? seems cool to me..
oh, you mean brass knuckles... ok...
"breast knuckles"? wow.. what are those? like a fist with some boobs around it? seems cool to me..
oh, you mean brass knuckles... ok...