zad was good but not even close to fly or lyn, same goes for nubby. at that time wc3 wasnt as competitve as today. moon pressed the random-button in the tavern and outplayed the opponent, he had no counterpart, nubby the so called counterpart wasnt a match for moon even with 80% handicap. but when wc3 in china had its peak and new faces spawned weekly, nubby was gone.
no way anyone can compare nubby/zad to the post 06 orcs fly/lyn. so lez sum it up
no good orcs -> everything imba,
good orc -> orc imba, simple as that
funny you come up with this 4k shit which only shows how desperate you are, but nontheless even in THAT discussion i wudve better and flawless arguments.

"Moon was god damn good, but not that special any more, same with sky"

Exactly that's the problem. The true pros of the past lose to those patchorcs that only got succesful with the last balance patch (aka Grubby, Lucifron) while the Orcs that actually won stuff before that are basically unbeatable and win the major tournaments unless they get unlucky in orc mirror.
Don't tell me you think it's a coincidence that Orc "suddenly" has the best players and no other race has won a tournament in forever.

Are you retarded? Moon is in great shape, he only loses vs Orcs, duh. Sky did qualify for WCG with Infi and Fly, duh.
And that nobody is able to stop "insert random pro Orc here" from winning the next tournament means it's imbalanced. I see how they play, blademaster clwas hex ensnare rightclick game over.
You have no idea what you're talking about.

Yes, you are retarded because even after telling you that Sky DID qualify for WCG 2009 you still say otherwise.
Now you answer me: To which non-orc did Moon lose in recent months? Shape my ass. Having to come up with new tricks and tactics to snatch a map win from ever the same playing Orcs only gets you so far. Oh, he only won WCG Korea qualifier and got 2nd at IEF in an impressive fashion. Must be out of shape.

The point is, Orc is always in shape, and to answer your question, any pro can beat Fly Lyn Grubby, the problem is there's always another Orc to step in and win the goddamn tournament. The random pro Orcs are just what the name implies. "New" faces and talents who were average at best before the patch are suddenly the elite of their respective country/league/team. People like Rob, Cash, Who, violet, all suddenly winning vs players they'd lose to pre-1.22

Of course most of these Orcs were good by any standard before the last balance patch. They just became imbalanced and win way more games now than they did when they were playing a balanced race.

hmmmm, i think we found a brandnew retard.

No I'm sorry, but the thing you're looking at is a mirror Disostu. Moofaasa was talking about WCG 2008 and wrote 2009 so stop boring us to death. Club of retards getting ownt again and again. @ M00fasa it is not about being "capable" of arguing. They're are just unwilling to argue. ;)

oh, im glad you didnt suicide after my last post raped the shit out of you and your overrated idol... as it seems you have grown new strengh and appear with another fakeacc to support your retarde pov. gj!

It's obvious you don't get half of what I'm saying, which comes as no surprise with you being an Orc player.
Just see you've been wrong about Sky, wrong about Moon, there's a high chance you're also wrong about Fly and all the other Orcs. Just look atthe tournament results and the games of any random Orc who's suddenly succesfulway above what they used to be. That inclcudes violet who suddenly beats elfs like Check and Remind, Who who only returned to pro-gaming because his race was imba and so on.
Open your eyes, dammit.

lol schnulle owned again. Why don't you go back a few posts and try to win your own fight? Ah wait, you got crushed already. bg no re, as they say. You're out, don't come back.

It is too easy to play perfect with Orc, the race is too simple.

It's a race for people who want fast success over competition and hard work. A race for simple minded people and ex cons.

The new generation's race, the race that does not require any hard strategical training/thinking nor as any impressive micro skills. All you need is a computer and a hell lot of free time. The race for the lazy, fits the new generation of ppl perfectly.

I own absolutely 0 fakeaccounts. But nice try failboy. Why should I do that?. You never "owned" me with your fluffy style of trash talking. You're making desperate efforts to "argue" against my facts. Hey and just remember who KICKED Moons Ass @WCG 2008 and E-Stars. You're are talking about the living Wc3 Legend Grubby, former 4K leader. #1 WCG; #1 ESL Conti-Finals(Lyn,Sky,Moon,Grubby), #2 EM Asia, #1 Gom-TV, #1-Estars, #2 Blizzcon. And Moon on the other hand? Hahahaha n/c. Moon vs Fly? 0:10 offline? Not yet, but soon.

After reading the last 15 posts or whatever I have come to the conclusion its no use talking to schnuggles and moofasa aka biggest retards in SK.

Even if all Orcs would step out and say they only win because of race, these 2 clowns would deny it.

Its hard to even imagine orcs being as stupid as these 2, I think it have something to do with their Intelligence level.

Just look at the games. I gave you names, look for yourself. You're not even trying to understand. Grubby winning nothing from 2005-2007, with the patch he wins WCG. Knoff, biggest noob orc of the scene, with patch he wins dreamhack. Violet, "The Sk talent" that didn't make it and got fired, with patch, he's back and beats players far above him. Who, another "talent" who got lucky once, then retires and comes back to get easy wins because of his race.

That the best orcs win all the tournaments is no excuse that no other race wins any. It's statistically impossible. There is no coincidence or skill difference involved. How can you not see that?

Rofl at schnulle again. He flames me in my guestbook for making up stupid stuff while he defends a guy who say Sky didn't qualify for WCG 09 and he keeps saying that Fly is 10:0 vs Moon offline while he got -10 thumbs for saying the same thing before while the Moon 2:1 Fly at IEF was right there on the same page :D
Epic fail is fail.

hehe, ex cons. Made me lol.

#1 ESWC 2005
#1 CPL 2005
#1 Blizzcon 2005
#3rd WCG 2005
#1 SEC 2005
#1 Digital Live 2005

+ Wc3l Champion
+ eSports WC3 Player of the Year 2005
+ eSports WC3 Player of the Year 2006
+ eSports "Playe"r of the Year 2006
+ MVP in Wc3l

Failplayer fails again and again. I'm done here. No talk to idiots anymore :D

2006 ? nothing
2007 ? nothing
And those wc3 player awards are nothing but laughable. Just shows how big amount of the scene that are completely clueless about the actual game

xaxaxa rofl, your arguments just got shattered once again. im a bit dissapointed though, you didnt mention dh06 and wcg-ned, that worries me a bit... are you sick? swine flu? T_T

Is it just me, or is this Moofasa guy just throwing in the word 'damn' before every word? Damn.

moofasa you stupid bitch dont talk shit about an old school player like check, he played fucking wc3 before your sorry little ass was even born and was a elf master of the first hour with players like evenstar and moon.

i like your theorie though, orc is not overpowered it just happens to be that EVERY orc player is in super shape and all the non orc player are out of shape.

ps: i love shadowleage, ud players who prolly did not touch the game having 5x the micro of players like lucifron makes me laughing for hours.

You ignorant fucktard, maybe try think as a change? Why do you think Grubby, Lyn, fly, viOlet, who, you name it are in good shape? WHY? You think its all because they mystericly all happen to hit the top curve at the exact same time? eeeh? Geez....

UD doesnt have any real good pro? Roger that. Hu has only Infi and Sky? id say th000 is "pretty" good hu aswell.

moofasa your dumb as fuck shut it now

ToD has always been the best hum vs NE not that shocking that he can win Remind, besides Remind might be focusing on his Orc mu, Happy winning Moon second best UD micro beast winning Moon is not shocking either. Trying to disapprove imbalance with two random games is awesome aswell, you are clearly biased just like everyone else here, please dont try to act

Winning what? Do you mean everybody calling you a mentally impaired is some kind of compliment to you?

top orcs drop maps and lose bo3 to "lesser" players often to human players. Lucifron WhO ViOlet. Its true night elves suck because they lose so much against UD I think Orcs should teach elves some tricks against UD.

That you have to add in wc3l and fanboy awards to some european and Korean undead dominated tournaments shows you're even believing what you're saying.
But fine, 2006-2007 then, still 2 years vs one for me, schnulle :)

moofasa, stop trying/trolling. Saying Moon is out of shape is... well I use that word often but yeah, you`re retarded, it just fits. The loss vs Happy (if it's the game I think it is) was like 3 or 4 months ago right when Moon WAS out of shape. But again, show me his last loss vs a non-orc. Might even be that game vs Happy.You obviously don't even watch Moon's games, just like hawkii or schnulle, but rant about his very few losses without looking at the amount of awesome games he pulled vs Sky, Infi, Focus, Soccer etc.

Again, it's statistically impossible for a balanced race to dominate that much. Elf imba(domination in 2007 is NOTHING compared to Orc domination now. Look at that esportsfrance article where like 18 out of 20 torunaments have an Orc in the top2, and like 15 of them Orc won. That doesn't even inckude the 3rd and 4th places.
Finally, listen to the pros like moon, infi, th000 etc. calling Orc no skill and imba.

I mean wtf:
http://www.sk-gaming.com/player/140-Moon

checkmate.

haha this still going on? rofl

Moofasa for the record, its not 1 person, its everyone calling you retarded back upped with facts.

Also its not only about statistics, dont only see the result, see the games and you know orc is imbalanced, when an orc player plays good and controls the game like Orc can, no matter how good the enemy plays no matter what choices he does, the Orc player will win, orc only loses because they dont use the Orc utilities to the max aka they dont play good enough.

Orc are imbalanced, if you can't see that than I'm sorry to say that you are a blind motherfucker.

and here comes the next einstein of wc3 Moofasa that will try to tell us that always somebody will whine because he doesn't play orc and it depends on mu bla bla bla. Just compare ud vs orc now and in the past, was quite different (f.e. the last game of fov and fly) and as u can see elves are forced to abuse only one strategy (talons) because when they play bears it's highly possible that they will be left with 2 heroes and few dryads because the super imba sw/kodo mix killed their bears (like remind vs violet in the prev. zotac), well i can agree that elves and humans are doing good but ud should be allowed to do so too

Oh, suddenly rowing back, are we?out of his prime, out of shape... Only losing to Orcs... ah wait, you dodge that one for 5 posts now.
I named lots of patchorcs already. Learn to read.
You are beyond help. There's no difference between 5th race Moon and the Moon today if you look at his games. You probably weren't even around back then. The problem is that Orc dumbs down the game to the ever same strategy (on both sides) with Orcs having advantages on most maps and ofc the advantage of only training one strategy vs all races on all maps.
Enough of this. You are retarded, everybody but schnulle agrees with this.

he also lost a bo5 vs TeD. TeD is a noob. ToD won remind in the important shadowleague with serious maps like Lost Temple where Remind played Orc. Btw Does anyone know how many times WhO has won vs Infi ??

Who > Infi(1:0) NiceGameTV League Season 1
Who < Infi(0:2) PGL Season IV

WTF

How did the discussion lead to that?

yeah what a retard

Yeah ok now beat TeD at a bo3

TeD would pwn any orc with a race change within 10 mins. There should be those tournaments to see how freaking hard the undead got against this inhumanly easy controllable race

Holy Fucking Shit, this thread is like a mass retard convention.

Sweet would pwn TeD with mass necros