Hi folks,
I think that UD and ORC are best race for two reason: UD currently has to very good mu's (on pro level). Every elf is free win and hu ain't that tough either. Only freelose is vs orc. So why ud can't win tournaments is because they lose 80% games vs orcs. But in every league UD is fucking good.

Worst race atm hu.

Please show some manner at the discussion, no "Grubby causes imbalance because his tears made blizzard do 1.23" comments

Human has never been good - there have been only good human players
Orc - always been a decent race, just because Grubby cries a lot doesnt make it bad
UD - mostly lacked good players to improve it, but now with Happy and TeD I guess things will change
Elf - seems that when there is no Moon to create new stuff up, the noobelves who know only DH/Panda/Dryads/Bears fail miserably as usual.Waiting for Mr.Moon to come back again and make Elf imba

overall - Orc/Undead/Elf/Human

Battle Net Season 7 - Korea

8 Players

5 Nightelfs
2 Orcs
1 Undead

Too bad or? "FIVE" Nightelfs but where is the "FIFTH Race" ? ; )

Ah ok he did not qualify because ELF is tooo weak!

Thanks for finally admitting that elf was never imba, that their units suck and that they only ever won anything thanks to Moon.
But I agree with the race ranking. Ellf and Human struggle lately, but the recent results of HuvNE give elf the edge. The matchup was always the most balanced one, but at the moment Human players struggle. Not sure if it's cause of shape or because they've been playing the same strat for 4 years straight.

schnuggelsretard: Grubby going 0-3 in group stage while 3 other Orcs reach top3, does that mean Orc is weak or that your idol sucks?

Funplayer: Moon getting raped by Lyn 1:3 and 0:3 or 0:2 vs Focus does not mean elf = weak because Check was able to beat Lyn TWICE :).

Check > Focus
Check > Grubby
Check > Lyn(3:0;3:2)
Check > Fly100%
Check > Who
Check > Lucifron

SO WHAT? :D
Any Questions?

whining about imba is not really helpfull, giving suggestions on how to fix it could be helpfull.

So here goes:
Blademaster nerf: make windwalk not able to walk through units

moonwell "buff": make moonwells not use up all their juice on healing mana... this is just annoying. Get them back to how they were before maybe.

human buff: this race is the most fucked race of them all (not neccercerily meaning that it's the worst race). The Human tactics we see today with 1 million towers is basicly the best tac in every MU for human. And it's really boring. What we need here is some kind of new upgrade or whatever, making rifle/priest a viable tactic-choice again. maybe a movementspeed-upgrade. Human is the only race that has slow movespeed without being able to do anything about it. I think this is much of the reason why humans play the (boring) way they do today. Another (small) nerf to towers might be viable if u buff rifle/priest.

UD: no change

This is just my suggestion on how to attempt to balance stuff out

if bm goes nerfed how orc's will win their's matches?

Yeah, once again there's ONE elf player who can win in ONE matchup. He still regularly loses to UD and isn't on Moon's level vs Human.
While we have like 7 Orcs (Lyn, Fly, Luci, Grubby, Focus, Like, even Sting and violet beat elfs better than them) who CAN and WILL win if they don't get completely outplayed, thanks to their no brain strategy.

Of course elf is weak.

Korea has always been a Nightelf country. Name ANY NELF not from Korea who has to be counted to top 20. Let's see . . . Hot ? Yes, still. . . hanf? kidding me?! Some Chinese elf like suhO, FD, Lyc not really. Most Korean progamer are nelf, now do the math. . .

Maybe Check knows how to beat orc because he trains with the greatest of all Bm abuser - Lucifron.

Check beat Lyn because of strategic variations, item luck and, most important of all, Lyn playing absolutely crappy. Fighting uphill on a choke half blocked by a factory? Let's go for it!

Check lost often enough vs Orcs lately.

TBH i dont think lucifron and check practice that much against each other! Check knows how to counter orc so well because he played orc for some time too!

Hm.
I feel like Orc is a little too strong in general.
Anything else depends on maps,luck and players.

game is balanced, maps not ;]

change a bit item drops, add new maps.

I never said Elf was not imba.It is imba because even the most retarded person on this planet can play DH/Panda/Dryads/Bears with a good success.I said that the noob elves now fail because Moon is not creating any new stuff up

orc has been the same since 1.21 or 1.22, so dont cry bitches!

"Now with Happy and TeD I guess things will change"

Yeah keep waiting xD

Well . . . Ted already changed A LOT? He had the biggest influence on undead for like the past 2 years. Happy for now is only a talented nerd.

Ensnare cannot cast on Hero will be good

Yeah right and be sure to fix hex so it can only be used on peasants/acos/peons/wisps.

As far as balance goes, ATM:
Orc> UD> HM> ELF
Elf is weakest race, 3exp for dryads is ridiculous, for a unit that dies faster than footmen. ORC is strongest race. Grubby loosing to a player thats inactive for 3 years and loosing 0-3 in Group stage is an embarrassment to not only the wc3 scene, but to the entire e-sport in general. I mean how can anyone be that bad while playing the strongest race. Grubby's suckingness makes orc look weak, but look at the result from REAL orc player, you will see the difference.

whatever

Soccer just switched to orc to beat space....
nope im sure he switched just because he felt like it.....

and then he beat FoCuS 3:1, one map he switched to Human...

Elfs leaving the sinking ship. Good for them that Orc is so easy to play, sad for the Undeads.

what about cyclone cannot be cas on hero
change bear upgrade time from 25,35 s to standard caster upgrade time 60,75 s

sure, if hunts get heavy armor then :))

go cry emo shit elf ur race was best since liek 1.18 and now when orcs abusers are better u r telling that ne is weak

No man, elfs were just more creative and the better players. Just like Orcs are the better players now. Just that they are not creative at all.

Not every orc is an abuser. Lyn is the best player at the moment, I think all can agree on that.
I think one nerf that's really needed is some crit change to avoid 250+ dmg / hit which is ridiculous. Either limit the damage or change items so they don't stack, whatever. BM is the problem. The scene was really a better one when nelf was slightly advantaged over the other races, we all had something to whine about . . . good old days. Only constant failure is Grubby, some things never change.

Shy > Lyn @ G-League
Shy > Grubby @Wc3l Final
Shy > Fly100% @WC3L Final
Shy > Happy

ELF so fucking Weak. :)

Sky also lost 0-3 and he's playing the noobie race + he's massing towers 24/7.

So 2 balanced and 1 weak matchup makes elf strong? You retard probably still think Orc is weak because your idol Grubby still loses all the time with his imba race.

Losing 0-3 with a "noobie" race is better than losing 0-3 with the imba race, especially at this pro level of play. Good work owning your own noob idol indirectly, you really know your stuff.

IMO there only needs to be 1 change implemented to perfectly balance wc3

"Summoned units no longer grant XP when they get dispelled via spells or abilities. You still recive XP if you kill them with direct damage"

new maps would also be a welcome change

well that is certainly a bunch of shit.
There is no reason to make summoned units even better

The only reason for undead's weakness is orc becoming more and more powerful. An Undead passing an Orc player in a tournament is already a reason to celebrate. Vs elf and hu ud is advanced or equal. It's only the incredibly imbalanced mu against orc. Btw some minutes ago lyn 2-0ed Ted aka Undeads last hope.