hey ho...
i is there somebody,who could explain how to play the "rifle-caster" strat?
and why was it so mighty?
and could somebody post a few links,where i can download a few replays(version 1.22) plsss?(=
thanks a lot (=

this used to be a good strat back in the days when casters were stronger and there was no panda

if u want to give some free wins to your opponents , feel free to play this "strategy"

you build rifles and casters(all the units from the arcane sanctum), Kemper is the king of riflecaster nowadays and he plays it vs everything, so go to wcreplays,replayers,war3.replays.net etc and search.

how many WCGs did Kemper win

oh right........

see replays kemper or oldschool heman in eswc04, sky in wcg05, etc.

@hostilepulse
y in wcg rus kemper with rifle-caster won vs kpect and frizzer in playoff, but he lose vs xyli and happy, so he got 6 place -.-

sry for bad eng :)

@ targa,ty ;)

vs elf rifle caster is still good :D atleast in ladder games :D

could u explain,how to use rifle-caster against nelf and against which nelf-strat will work the rifle-caster well?(sry about my english,i know that it isnt very well^^)

against dh/panda dryad bears (so basicly what elf always does vs hum)

you need to play with fastexpand with am, mk or naga 2nd. Spellbreaker in front, riffle/priests behind. Imo its better to play with some additional mortars (against dryads) and its quite hard to keep your riffles alive against panda, so be sure to have enough healscrolls with you.

Sky vs Creo

http://www.wcreplays.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100405
http://www.gosugamers.net/warcraft/replays/9199

Xyligan vs Lyn

http://www.sk-gaming.com/forum/12/2010423/
Enter Xyligan and "Filter Replays". 6th Result.

ToD vs Space

http://www.sk-gaming.com/forum/12/2010423/
Enter ToD%Space.

well u go rifles + morts vs driads, take am + bm, mass aoe, sb are immune to mort splash and aoe, sorcs slow down driads, and priests for dmg + and dispell roard and heal, in ladder not many elfs make fairies, so they mostly loose to rifle caster :D

Sorcs slow down dryads lol

are you stupid? :s hello?! MAGIC IMMUNE!?

well sorcs slow down bears, and when morts agaisnt dryads, dry cant dispell so much slow :D and bears cant run away from aow if theyre slowed

" bears cant run away from AOW "

k

rifle caster was strong because sorcs were stronger, rifle had more hp, bolt was better for that strat(little bit less dmg but longer stun to heroes) and last but not least they had autoexpand aka they could produce militia at every townhall, so an expand was hard to take down, and with an expand backing you up rifle caster is very strong cause its expensive.

dont use rifle caster vs elf, its simple :P you can use it to push vs fast bears, take naga second and rush him with militia, few caster, foots and rifle before he has the masterupgrade, best tower him while you do that. otherwise rifle caster is quite weak vs elf imo.

its mighty? never seen.

roflcasters is a really good strat against elf, against orc its also good but skip the rifles and just do mass casters.. against ud you will fail with this strat unless you can do a good push very early

riflcaster has become a suicide, so sky invented the sky rush out of it. This is the best advice anyone will ever give you, forget rifle, use ivory towers.

Nice replay`s I remember with Rifle-Caster.

Sky vs Creo on TM (probably not 1.22) (Hum vs Nelf)
Xyligan vs Lyn on EI (pretty recent) (Hum vs Orc)
ToD vs Space(?) on Turtle Rock (But I think they played with smurfs) (Hum vs UD)

Rifle-Caster need`s brilliant timing and a good ping (fast micro needed) to win.
Can work well against Elf without expansion.
Against Orc and UD you`ll need expansion to win I guess. Or tower him at the right moment.

http://www.sk-gaming.com/forum/12/2010423/

Creo Sky TM was the 3rd game of the Bo3 WCG finals (when Sky could have gotten his third title, but instead Creo made a legend of himself)

Xily Lyn on EI is one of the best games of this year imho, huge must see

But in both case, hu fails with riffle casters ;)

Dunno about the ToD vs Space game though ;)

actually the 3rd game on TM i think Sky played rifles because he supposed that Creo would expect the fast expo and he lost to the hunt push that Creo did on GW so I dont think that Sky went rifles just for fun although he knew that this strategy was weak

oh noes he made a typo with 2 keys that reside next to each other

sorcs slow down driads

i guess that was a typo mistake as well

well morts agaisnt driads, driads cant dispell so much slow, they cant save all bears, staff only work twice, 2 hero 2 staff ...

thanks for all...so,now i will "ask" my real question,because i just wanted to know,why rifle-caster was so good and my,i call it "real question", is,could it work with orc also?e.g. u play fs,tc then headhunters(or berserker) shamans and walker?i think that it could work with enough micro because the shamans can slow the units and walker are very well because u don't want to lose so much units and the walker could play the part of the priests...i said headhunters,because i guess u have to push ur enemy as early as possible,but if u need more time or fail at the first push,u could tech to tier 3 and research the berserker upgrade and the master upgrade for the shamans... this strat is just an idea,but i think,it could work with enough micro,so pls,if there is an orc player with many micro,pls try this strat for a few times and write into this thread,if it worked...
and it would also be interessting to see the replays (=

actually from a theorycraft point of view, bm/sh/tc/headhunter+mastercaster ist the perfect army in wc3, no army is stronger. its pretty much proven due to the fact that ffa involves a lot of theorycraft when building armies, and in ffa it rocks the shit.

but concerning 1on1 the strat has too many flaws due to teching, resources needed and such, you wont be able to get the army you desire as fast as you want to, every race has killed your base before that.

and i wouldnt consider purge as a slow-spell, its costs too much mana for that, hasnt got much effect vs non-summons and you dont have the mana-aura. this unitcombo rocks @ t3 and is pretty much unbeatable in a open fight, but without mastercaster it is really weak. it relies on the combo of bloodlust/bezerk/healing wards/spirit link/heal wave, which gives you extremely much dmg/sec and unkillable units

i forgot the name, there was a ffa-player on azeroth who was #1 in ladder with that strat, invincible_rice or something like that. but you should forget to play it in solo, it is too weak early on.

Grubby used to use this strat in early TFT , didnt he ? It was widely used back then , but simply the way to beat it was discovered and thats pretty much why no1 uses it today

i really dont know, the first reps i saw from grubs have been grunts/shams/demos vs human rifle caster, i just know that strat from ffa, which i used to play years ago

Orc mass casters takes too much time and too much gold to use in good level games. If you wanna do some human-like expo/tower strategy and just hide in your base till tier3 and upgrades are finished, then it can work against a player who lets you do that. But when you reach a certain level of play, you won't face opponents who are dumb enough to ignore you the whole game.

you must be pretty dumb to just stay and hide in ur base lol.Actually only a dumb opponent would do some pathetic tries to break your defence with all these towers.The better would instead creep the whole map , start expos meanwhile u stay with your lvl 2/3 am in your base LOL

Yes, that's why i said it won't work against decent players who scout+know how to play. My point was that nobody will leave you alone long enough to finish the upgrades needed for mass casters to work unless they really really suck. And like you kind of said yourself, if they do leave you alone but go and creep up high/expand, then they'll just outmass you because they have 2 or 3 goldmines producing cheaper units.

http://tv.esl.eu/de/vod/view/20863 well,its german,but you dont have to listen them ;)
at min 140 begins a game between take and eric,at lt,eric played fs/bm and mass caster,in the 2nd game he used the panda as first hero,2 cool games (= and the game,when eric played fs/bm and mass caster is the reason,why i guessed i the rifle-caster strat could work as orc also (=
pls new comments ;)

well take was a mediocre eps-player years ago, eric played last finals, you get the difference in skill, dont you?:p

well,but take plays sometimes against eps-player like leon or somebody else and he wins sometimes 1 map or even 2 "from" a bo3,so i guess he is still good,of course not as good as he was at the time,when he played for sk,but i guess he would still rule the eas 1st division...
and i just wanted to show how the strat could work ;)

maybe there is reason that noone of the good hus plays them anymore beacuse the more or less never work!

awesome thread!

mogi

lasse, u random!