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Where do we go now? Life after pro WoW
Common knowledge in esports says that WoW is skill-less game. Yet former SK player Orly is proving that he, at least, can compete with the RTS players at their own game.
By Michael 'Zechs' Radford
Mar 16, 2010 14:41
Common knowledge in esports says that WoW is skill-less game. Yet former SK player Orly is proving that he, at least, can compete with the RTS players at their own game.In my past columns I have often tried to draw parallels between esports and traditional sports. But when it comes to post-retirement activity the two could hardly be more different. Where a lot of ex-sportsmen go into TV punditry or coaching, almost zero do the same in esports. Why? Well for starters there is basically no such thing as coaching in esports. Similarly, TV punditry is very limited with only one or two high profile streaming companies.
But what you sometimes see in esports that you almost never see in football or rugby or whatever else is players swapping games altogether. Granted, this happens between rugby league and rugby union almost every season but these are usually players at their peak, going to a similar sport for a higher wage. In football, it is practically unheard of.
One former SK player is setting an important precedent, however. Olivier 'orly' Bellemans retired from WoW a few months ago to practice Starcraft in preparation for Starcraft 2. In the past we saw SC players swap to WC3 and from myriad FPS games to other FPS games (Painkiller being a perfect example). But this is a much greater change; genre to genre.
What makes Orly’s case even more interesting is that so far he is making a damn good job of it. Sorry to all those people who like to claim that WoW doesn’t need any skill, but the Belgian is already a top contender, albeit at a very early stage. With two Zotac cups already gone by, Orly finished 2nd and 1st respectively. He even beat seasoned RTS players like Dennis 'HasuObs' Schneider and Silviu 'Nightend' Lazar en route.
To be clear: it is still very, very early days in the SC2 story. But the fact that a player can successfully switch not only games, but also genres is a great sign for the future of esports and a testament to the versatility of WoW players. Whether or not Orly will be able to compete with the Koreans if/when they start taking the game seriously is another (excuse the pun) matter but surely the same goes for any Western player.
The advantages that Orly has are twofold. Firstly, his retirement from professional WoW meant that he could concentrate fully on preparing for SC2. This gave him an edge over the WC3 players who were expected to do well (and are doing fine, by the way) because they still had leagues to play in. Secondly, he is still just about young enough at 23 to learn a new game. The average retirement age for a pro gamer is somewhere around 25 but that is definitely a blurry kind of number and varies hugely from game-to-game and country-to-country.
Even so, 23 is probably at the late end of the scale, which could also mean another milestone. If Orly can keep up his early success it shows that esports doesn’t have to be a pastime for kids, which is something I never really believed anyway. So, well done, Olivier, for pushing back the boundaries of “common knowledge” in so many different ways.
But what you sometimes see in esports that you almost never see in football or rugby or whatever else is players swapping games altogether. Granted, this happens between rugby league and rugby union almost every season but these are usually players at their peak, going to a similar sport for a higher wage. In football, it is practically unheard of.
"We saw SC players swap to WC3 but this is a much greater change; genre to genre."
One former SK player is setting an important precedent, however. Olivier 'orly' Bellemans retired from WoW a few months ago to practice Starcraft in preparation for Starcraft 2. In the past we saw SC players swap to WC3 and from myriad FPS games to other FPS games (Painkiller being a perfect example). But this is a much greater change; genre to genre.
What makes Orly’s case even more interesting is that so far he is making a damn good job of it. Sorry to all those people who like to claim that WoW doesn’t need any skill, but the Belgian is already a top contender, albeit at a very early stage. With two Zotac cups already gone by, Orly finished 2nd and 1st respectively. He even beat seasoned RTS players like Dennis 'HasuObs' Schneider and Silviu 'Nightend' Lazar en route.
"With two Zotac cups already gone by, Orly finished 2nd and 1st respectively."
To be clear: it is still very, very early days in the SC2 story. But the fact that a player can successfully switch not only games, but also genres is a great sign for the future of esports and a testament to the versatility of WoW players. Whether or not Orly will be able to compete with the Koreans if/when they start taking the game seriously is another (excuse the pun) matter but surely the same goes for any Western player.
The advantages that Orly has are twofold. Firstly, his retirement from professional WoW meant that he could concentrate fully on preparing for SC2. This gave him an edge over the WC3 players who were expected to do well (and are doing fine, by the way) because they still had leagues to play in. Secondly, he is still just about young enough at 23 to learn a new game. The average retirement age for a pro gamer is somewhere around 25 but that is definitely a blurry kind of number and varies hugely from game-to-game and country-to-country.
Even so, 23 is probably at the late end of the scale, which could also mean another milestone. If Orly can keep up his early success it shows that esports doesn’t have to be a pastime for kids, which is something I never really believed anyway. So, well done, Olivier, for pushing back the boundaries of “common knowledge” in so many different ways.
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p.s wow takes no skill
but yeah its amazing he can switch from game(type) like that and remain at the top. gj orly and looking forward to what SC2 can bring to esports
finish your studies or start some one
manage one team
find a job in the area of the computers
a lot of thing the wolrd is yours
Anyway, orly's test will come later on when everyone have access to the game. But it's definitely impressive that he's as successful as he is, even if it's early on.
Bye
I think it's a really smart move, since SC2 is a great game and is on a good course to become a major game in e-sports.
What is even worse is that you haven't even taken contact to the guy. For what we know, he could have been massing SC-games before picking WoW up, thus making him a RTS-player and not a MMO-player by definition. What is certain is that he has been following the SC-scene for years (he stated so earlier), which would indicate that he has more than a brief interest in the genre. Even more, 5-6 minutes of Google research leads me to rumours of him having played SC BW for almost a year before stopping completely with WoW.
What you are implying in your column, can be explained in several different ways, of which you only chose to promote the one that fits into your cause. Provoking: yes. Good journalism: not even close.
I'm not getting into a "my game is better than your game" argument because it's far too banal for words. On top of that, it is actually possible to like more than one game/genre. It seems like that might be news to some people.
"Your argument is that because he has played WoW at a high level, and now plays SC2 at a high level, there is a high versatility amongst WoW-players in general. I know that you don't even believe in that argument yourself."
I'm merely trying to make the argument. I haven't seen a single intelligent response that debates it sensibly - just personal attacks and mindless "lol wow is bad" comments... as per usual.
"To be clear: it is still very, very early days in the SC2 story. But the fact that a player can successfully switch not only games, but also genres is a great sign for the future of esports and a testament to the versatility of WoW players."
No, that's a testament to the versatility and drive of Orly. It's those kind of phrases that make me dislike your articles sometimes. Have to agree with Phil here.
I think you are getting the kind of response your argument qualifies for. As I stated, there can be lots of explanations for Orly's ventures in SC2, but you only chose to promote one of them, thus eliminating EVERY single reason to argue on an intelligent level. Why would anyone make a valid counterargument, when you've already discarded every option but this being proof of WoW-players being versatile?
Just to notice; I think the column is well written, I just think you could have done so much more with it than you chose to do.
Although "His retirement from professional WoW meant that he could concentrate fully on preparing for SC2". What exactly does "prepare for SC2" mean? The beta was not released until 2-3 weeks ago, I'd like to know how exactly he "prepared" for its release. I don't really buy this.
Overall, great idea for an article but really needed ORly involved.
Post:
50% true (your oppinion)
75% true (your oppinion)
100% true (your oppinion and everyones else)
and u seem to follow this...
People look at first think mm maybe..then mm yeah I thin so..and in the end YOU GOT IT! YEAH!!!
Overall I can 100% assure you that ONE YEAR IN STARCRAFT IF FREAKING NOTHING. You must be uber Godly uber MEGA tripple Flash to be good after playing for a Year in SC:BW. And thae fact he followed SC scene means nothing. Maxx u can understand or get to know 75% of buildorders or things which win games. And only when u know all about game SKILL part starts to play in...pff means nothing!
And saying WoW is all about comp is like saying Starcraft is all about build order or CS/Quake/CoD is all about clicking fast enough...dumb sht. Equal to answering to a question with YES or NO aloe without saying why.
Also theres that crying type of people who claim something like "its not skill when u have rocket launcher and I have machinegun lolz...so u suck blabla"...its not my fault u got megahealth instead of rocketlauncher u dumbass.
Also thers TONS and proly MOST OF ALL CRY'ERS who always think its LAG/game being sht/mouse/keyboard/monitor or PATCORCS or balance which holds peeps back. Hahah yeah. ITs not skill unless its mirror race/guns its game proly yeah but if all is same (mirror fight with same guns or classes) then why THAT is not skill??? Oh yeah...YOU WAS IN WRONG MOOD...its jsut its not your day.................................................................................HAHAHAH
It's always ment as a comparison to the typical ESport Games like Wc3 and Shooters like CS or QL....and in that comparison WoW looks horribly.
I know many ppl dont want to face that, but simply the luck factor takes so much skill out of your hands, as nearly everything can crit. Just taking the thing of crits makes the game more luck-based than every other "real" ESport game.
Ofc you need to communicate well and need to have a good knowledge of the game, but it is not as dynamic as other games are. The game starts, you have a plan on whom you focus and you start doing that and you will most likely know what your enemy will try. yeah, in wc3 you also have a plan how you want to win the game, but as a game lasts over 10 or even over 20 minutes, you can't even plan 10% of it for sure, which is different in WoW. Not to talk of CS...
And the balance is total bullshit...every patch has "its comp"...well, we dont need to discuss that one.
I guess these are simple facts which you cant deny. WoW might be fun and so on, but it's surely not on a level with shooters or (good) RTS games.
People think of WOW and say no skill but they don't seperate PVE from PVP and instead look at WOW is just WOW, PVE is piss easy but PVP isn't much, but feel free to play WOW for a week then head to the next MLG and beat the best and show the world that WOW indeed is so easy that anyone can win anything against anyone.
Those 2 sentance in no way correlate with eachother. The fact a top player can change games and be good at his new game doesnt mean the old game was skill full, it just means a good player happened to start out with wow.
If he himself said wow does take skill i could see the point in this article but i didnt read that anywhere
Just please stop posting.
I bet you think about yourself as controversial or thought-provoking yet you are a complete joke to everyone. I feel sorry for you.
So, well done, Olivier!!
Get a job.
But the biggest "skillgame" is quakelive for me you can have to move right have to aim right handle bad spawns handle beeing out of control, predict what your enemy will do etc but thats just my opinion